Mathew
Have Westerners caused a lot of the strife that we have today in the world taking into consideration that Westerners have used & abused & raped & pillaged Eastern countries & their people for over a thousand years now?
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Western plight on the world
60 Replies
Scarletta ∙ 16 weeks ago
"Westerners" outlawed slavery in a bloody civil war, started the first modern day representative republic with a social compact that has made no man the subject of a King or Queen or State Mandated Religion, given opportunity for any man or women willing to work hard the opportunity to make something of themselves and to pull their families out of squalor, give more to charity, give more educational opportunities including full scholarships, and are depended upon as the main trade partners, infusing billions into foreign economies, so I'd say NO.
Mathew ∙ 16 weeks ago
G’day Scarletta
The Easterners where into science & philosophy when the Westerners where still eating each other & living in caves, this is a fact especially in certain parts of Europe. Most of our knowledge in the world has come from or derived from some sort of Eastern knowledge anyway.
If you take into account that Westerners have been plundering the Easterners not just for knowledge but for resources as well since the crusades wouldn’t you admit that Westerners have added to the plight of the world? Don’t’ forget most of these billions have been plundered from the Easterners anyway in one way or another look at the Middle East for starters.
To infuse billions into the East to create more pollution isn’t what I would call a positive thing actually it’s one of the biggest plights Westerners could have bestowed on the world.
Love
Mathew
Scarletta ∙ 16 weeks ago
Hello Mathew:
The West is not the cause of the ills of the world, in fact, due to the freedom
provided through natural law, people were able to invent improvements that
are enjoyed by the entire world which would continue to be a disease ridden nasty place otherwise..... The east & middle east are teaming with slavery and women continue to be second class or less citizens in much of the east and middle east as well.
You speak of people being "used & abused & raped & pillaged ", however that is exactly what happens to girls, women, children and even some men every day in parts of the east and middle east and much of it either goes unpunished, is encouraged or totally ignored by governments in that part of the world.
Sorry, I do not buy into the "blame America & the west first" propaganda.
Who are the worst polluters in the world? Have you seen the pollution in Beijing for instance? As for "plundering knowledge" are you kidding? If they had the knowledge to create the light bulb, the automobile, the airplane, etc. etc. why didn't they?
Mathew ∙ 16 weeks ago
G’day Scarletta
I can see where you are coming from but everything you have said that’s nasty about the East it also happened & happens in the West, it is obvious you don’t know what happens in Western society to do with the sex trade & a hell of a lot more & very little is done about it believe you me.
So you don’t think the West has done any wrong to do with the crusades, Spanish inquisition or the looting of Egypt & a multitude of other countries. Let’s come up to date, look at what the French did in Morocco & after the First World War, do you want me to start on the English, how about invading another country under false pretences for oil, does that sound familiar. Do you actually know what happened prior & during the crusades & the Spanish inquisition? Not by the sounds of it.
I love how the West especially the US will pound there chest saying they civilised the world but at what cost, the life of the planet & ourselves through highly toxic pollutants of all kinds which was yet but another Western invention, give me a break please.
Who invented gun powder but once the west got a hold of it what happened; amazingly enough it got turned into a weapon of devastation. The biggest polluters are questionable, the yanks are now polluting the subterranean world through hydraulic fracturing, they pump highly toxic substances into the ground while they are drilling. How about the industrial revolution & consumerist materialism which has an insatiable hunger for energy that’s beyond what we can sustain environmentally & energy wise, this is but another great Western invention which is likely to end human existence. Yep I think the West should pat themselves on the back, what for has got me!!!
Don’t get me wrong the East certainly isn’t perfect by far but you’re actually telling me the West has nothing to do with the way the world is after everything they have done over the thousand years in question? I’m sorry your either arrogant & ignorant or just plain brainwashed, I think it’s the latter by the sounds of it. I could go on & on with how the great Western powers have served the world but if you’re ignorant of the facts it’s pointless.
Love
Mathew
Scarletta ∙ 16 weeks ago
Hello Mathew:
Since you have gone from propaganda to name calling there is no longer anyway to communicate positively at this time as it seems that you have a worldview that blames the West and the United States in particular for all the ills of the world without crediting the US with all the positives (technology, freedom, natural law as a basis for social compact).
LA Green ∙ 16 weeks ago
I'm not sure how to respond to this...so I'll start by saying this, the west and the east are equally wrong. If you really look at it, the East having older civilizations would be more in the wrong then the west. I think the west mimics what they have learned. The east evolved and as mankind went into the future, the rise of the west began along with technology and "bright" ideals. I'm almost sure if technology now was around when the Art of war was created, the same results of today would have been of the past; and we would probably be worse then were are now.
Mathew ∙ 16 weeks ago
G’day LA Green
This could be quite controversial if one is a little ignorant of the facts.
The East being older didn’t produce toxins, biological & nuclear weapons to pollute & destroy each other & they didn’t device the industrial revolution & consumerist materialism which has an insatiable appetite for energy which of course destroys & pollutes the Earth on mass. The westerners did this in no time flat that the easterners wouldn’t even thought of doing for a very logical reason.
But of course the Easterners didn’t have that sort of technology otherwise they would have used it which I disagree with fully because for starters they had a different mode of thought which does dictate our actions & of course thought, in other words they didn’t devise these things because they had the right mentality not the wrong mentality as we do.
Did they have such technology? If you find spectacles in soil which was carbonated dated over 2000 years old & that actual batteries have been found in the middle east you would have to wonder but not only that light globes appear on hieroglyphs in ancient Egyptian temples.
I think their mentality was quite different, they weren’t looking to destroy themselves over such a short period like westerners they just wanted to live & die.
You might be interested in this link which has some startling information on ancient technology; most of what we in the west pat ourselves on the back for was already invented. http://s8int.com/index.html
Nothing is what it seems I’m afraid but of course those who are arrogant will dismiss this.
Love
Mathew
Mathew ∙ 16 weeks ago
G’day Bloggers
I’m afraid I do find us westerners arrogant, ignorant & yes even stupid to think that we are God’s gift to the rest of the planet, yes we might have done some good or maybe even a lot of good but in a short period of time we have done insurmountable damage to our ourselves & the environment, I really can’t see a lot to pat ourselves on the back for.
Love
Mathew
Ritesh Srivastav ∙ 16 weeks ago
The East had always a closed society but opened religious views....thus it prospered in wisdom but remain backward in social development ....while with the west it was the reverse case...hence it lacked spiritual wisdom but prospered in social matters ....
The East & the west now must exchange each others knowledge for betterment of their own society ...time has come to reunite & shape the world together ...!
Natasha ∙ 16 weeks ago
Wooooooowwwwwwwwwwwww. Really??? Okay, so I get it. We all need something to point the finger at. How about this: First step - go to the bathroom. Second step - look in the mirror. Third step - point that finger at the person looking back at you.
You want the world to be a better place? Then go make it a better place. Don't sit around pointing fingers. EVERYONE is to blame. From the people here today to the people gone yesterday.
Do you drive a car? Use aerosol cans? Eliminate wastes? Newsflash: you are harming the environment. Your existence itself is a pollutant if you look hard at it.
Drug trade? Sex slaves? I have heard of it occurring in MANY countries. Not just western civilization. Another news flash: This isn't a new discovery. This stuff has been going on for a long time. If a caveman wanted a woman he grabbed her by the hair and dragged her back to his cave. Doesn't sound pleasant to me. Can you honestly say none of the wealthy of your country has "purchased" a woman before? Is there no drug abuse or sales in your country? Prostitution doesn't happen where you are? I call bull shit. If none of that occurs in your country please tell me where you live because I would LOVE to move there.
The East has always had open religious views? Umm, okay. Ever hear of the Holocaust? The west has been participants in genocide, yes. But don't claim the East is innocent. Look at history. Spanish inquisition. Attacks on Israel. America sent Japanese CITIZENS to it's own versions of concentration camps after Pearl Harbor. Didn't I hear recently about a little Muslim girl being shot for wanting education? The list goes on and on.
Don't shout this crap about the West being to blame. The whole damned world is going to hell and all we can do is sit around and point fingers. Ha. Sweep your own side of the street people.
My history may be a little rusty, but I remember the highlight reel. Sorry if I "offended" anyone. But, that's what happens when you enter a controversial discussion with a wide diversity of people involved. Someone always gets offended. This is just my opinion -- which I exercise my FREEDOM to express here in my spiritually stupid country of America. Thanks for letting me share.
Natasha ∙ 16 weeks ago
I must admit I find this game of "my country is better than yours" quite amusing.
Ritesh Srivastav ∙ 16 weeks ago
Natasha ....u cannot erase historical records on emotional grounds ....every culture got through different stages of social & spiritual evolution because of varying ideologies ....Western culture was materialistic in substance with negligible signs of spiritual devlopment but that is not a criticism but an ideology ....East was predominantly spiritual & that's why it remained open to invasions from the west....don't joke the reality ....!
The best of western materialism & eastern spiritualism is yet to unite effictively to challenge the present miseries of the world ....friend ....!
Natasha ∙ 16 weeks ago
So, does that make spiritual wars okay? And where I live -- it's referred to as the bible belt, my friend. However, we don't practice spiritual snobbery, so you can practice whatever beliefs you wish without discrimination. Well, that was before Sept. 11th. Now, we have some religious idiocy running around. But, that's certain individuals, not our society as a whole. Most of us still think with an open-mind. So what are you basing this spiritual hierarchy on anyway? I don't quite understand where you get this superiority complex from? Keep in mind spirituality and religion are not the same thing.
Ritesh Srivastav ∙ 16 weeks ago
Religion is the manifestation of spirituality my friend .....I find ur thought more emotional than it should be....ok....I think u could not get my words entirely ....
Take caste system in general ....the worst form of caste discrimination was. & is a. negative feature in eastern society ....lack of understanding about the material requirements of human life made it scientifically inferior than. the west....& that's why it couldn't resist invasions from the mighty western empires....but spiritual wealth was always with the east & that gave it enough tolerance & wisdom to face the challenges of human life ....both east & west learned from each other & the process continues....but unfortunately its slow....!
As for America ....it was itself a British colony in the past & only got independence in 1776.....So America was not a part of that western bruteness in a broader sense ....but that was history ....American revolution was the first to show the subdued nations the path of independence ....we had always been obliged to learn fro its culture & will continue to take inspiration from her I all fields of human excellence ....I hope this time u may get this friend ...!
Teddy ∙ 16 weeks ago
Mathew I hate to think that with all of your hate and frustrations of this place that you may be one step away from joining the Taliban terrorist groups , but with all of our faults ( and we do have them ) we DO send our money and people to help and we DON'T kill our women and men in public executions by shootings or hacking their heads off for showing their faces or being with someone they love and not allowing someone else to tell them who they have to marry and a whole host of other things. I think you are real close to being put on the list of the Government watch list section. And when you insult as a whole then you insult those who don't agree with what the government does do wrong. Because I am an American doesn't mean that I agree with EVERYTHING that America does and you make yourself look self righteous as though you do no wrong. And EVERYONE knows that isn't true,
Teddy ∙ 16 weeks ago
P.S. except for the technology part. I would lay odds that your bible ( if you read it ) will be loaded with ALL of what you accused us of and it would go as far back as the beginning of the written history. Slavery, rape, murder, all those things were here before we ( America ) existed . ALL I hear is the cry ( We can do those things in the name of ____________ but don't dare do it to us , boo hoo ).
KalamityJane ∙ 16 weeks ago
People with power always corrupt, it is the way of things. Before the Westerners were raping and pillaging, there were factions in the East doing the same thing. Women were sold into slavery at brothels to pay off their husbands' debts, and there were many civil problems that led to the burning of villages and families being slaughtered. and what about Genghis Khan? He's considered one of the most brutal and tyrannical war lords of ALL TIME, and he was most definitely Eastern.
Keep in mind that I am NOT saying that the West is completely without blame here. We have meddled in things that really just aren't our business in the East, saying that our way is the best and blah blah. It is culturally insensitive. And yes, some westerners have in fact raped and murdered easterners, but let's be real, one's geographic homeland doesn't make them a rapist/murderer. Some people are just bad people, and it's incredibly unfortunate when ANYONE regardless of their ethnicity becomes victim to these bad people.
I do think that the west needs to leave the east to do their own thing though. Maybe if we stopped paying attention to everything going on in other countries, we could fix some of our own. Because when it comes down to it, America knows what works for America, and those same things that work for us don't necessarily work for people in the middle east. And honestly, I don't know why we feel the need to send our "help" your way. I think the middle East has made it pretty clear that they don't want to be occupied by America and that they don't want us to be involved in their government, so being there is pretty pointless in my opinion. I mean, if I were to go to my neighbor's house, kick down there door and clean their house with my cleaning products and then tell them their cleaning products just weren't good enough I'd probably get arrested or they might just kick my ass. Because forcing people to do things the way you want them doesn't work. That's just the way free will works.
But my honest opinion is that pointing fingers is stupid as humanity just kind of sucks. When we work in a large group we tend to just piss all over each other.
And for the record, there are a LOT of Westerners who really don't want anything to do with the occupation of the East. And to lump all of us together as ignorant to your culture and rapers/pillagers of your land is seriously dick-ish. Some of my closest friends are in fact Muslims from Pakistan and India. And I think that they have a beautiful and interesting culture.
Mathew ∙ 16 weeks ago
G’day Fellow Bloggers
Sorry for such a conflictive post but boy didn’t I open up a can of worms. I won’t reply to each individual reply by will hopefully answer all of them in one counter reply.
Firstly I will mention that the psychological effect on a particular down trodden people will traumatise those people for a number of generations either it be eastern or western, this is one of the reasons I point the finger at the westerners.
I’m being accused of a number of things which is quite normal especially when one treads on toes & hits a raw nerve of course that raw nerve is raw maybe because of the truth which hit too close to the bone, action/reaction.
It’s saddens me that I’m just about the only westerner who can see both side of the story here but I’m not prejudice or bias in anyway that’s just one of my traits which infuriate some people.
Who got blamed for 9/11 & who got blamed for the Iraqi war? 9/11 was the psychological result of years of persecution by the west, they have had enough & yes became sorrowfully radical but of course the Iraqi war was different, it was a made up from lies.
How about the strife between Israel & the Arab world, you get westerners coming in dictating what Arab land to give to whom now look at the ongoing strife over there which was quite obvious what was going to happen from the start.
The Khans slaughtered yes but so did the crusaders around the same time but the crusaders also killed their own who dare live with Muslims but the Muslims where happily living with Christians. The Mongols accepted other religions under their dominance but the good Christians didn’t. Do you want me to go into the Spanish crusades & the thirty year war & so & so.
How long have us westerners blamed the easterners for this that & the other but as soon as you point the finger at a westerner all hell breaks loose, how pathetically prejudice & bias is that? I say to my fellow westerners if the cap fits wear it & by the some of the unsavoury remarks I got the cap certainly looks like it fits
Sorry but us westerners are awfully ignorant & arrogant at times you would have to admit but of course being western you sadly won’t.
Love
Mathew
Teddy ∙ 16 weeks ago
You are wrong with your assumptions and we will answer any challenge that you may put out by your words of ( do you want me to----) but don't get me wrong, I agree with a certain percentage of your thoughts. but we have lived by the Constitution on all sides for the majority part of American people. I am proud that you stand up for the afflicted but that is what we as a country try to do from the peoples point of view " I THINK " but I agree with you that the government has other agendas. but unless you want to gather people for a take over or unless you can get majority peoples votes, you will not change anything and are simply stirring the waters with no end in sight.
Mathew ∙ 16 weeks ago
G’day Teddy
Aren’t you the one who accused me of being hatful? How would you know I wonder a very silly statement but of course expected. So you think I’m stirring the pot instead of telling the truth the way it actually is. Do you know we have become compulsive liars to each other & ourselves, I’m tired of living the lie that’s all but if you want to make something more out of it that is up to you Teddy.
If you take a closer look you & others have hardly answered any of my challenges but I have of yours, just take a look how many things I have mentioned, they are just being totally ignored or glossed over unless they can be used against me like was tried with the Khans & consumerist materialism, I think anyone can see that. The fact is I’m after the facts not some delusional lie that the world has become accustom too.
My blog is about acceptance & that is exactly what I do I accept I am a westerner who is a part of this lie but do too many other westerners?
I’m not on here to make friends like so many here who wish to sell them elves but to tell the truth as I see it & if that’s some sort of crime I’m sorry for that but I’m going to continue with the truth as long as I live, if people are comfortable in living a lie I’m accepting of that but please don’t force such ideologies on to me, we do still live in a democracy don’t we???????
I will say it again, the easterners aren’t perfect by far but it wasn’t the westerners being down trodden for over a thousand years but the easterners, actually put yourself in eastern shoes but of course most westerners can’t but I feel I can so there is something wrong with that now!!!!!. …Democracy what democracy I can’t see a true democracy where one is slapped down for speaking out against wrong!!!
Again I have nothing to sell including my blog but so many others do so of course people are going to say what other people want to here, that’s basic logic as they are trying to sell themselves & their blogs. This wasn’t the correct site to post such a debate as of course it’s going to be bias in one way or another but it has been interesting.
Love
Mathew
LA Green ∙ 16 weeks ago
I don't think that we won't admit to it. I think as a western, we don't want to be the only one to blame. When you compare the west to other places in the world, it doesn't look so bad. However, I will agree that the west has brutally destroyed the environment but the east has brutally destroyed mankind. So since were one planet, everything get's lumped into as one; war, destruction and etc. In America, the North American slave trade was one of the worst things to be documented in history; mind you the key word is documented. Slavery was something that has always happened during mankind; for all we know, there could have been something more brutal but it wasn't documented.
Do you know why the Spanish only conquered the Philippines? The Philippines were the only country in Asia that excepted the Spanish into their land; do you know what China did? The Spanish showed up in China, and the Chinese took down the Spanish. The leader of the expedition, got his head cut off and told the survivors to take his head, back to the land they came from as a message sent. Thus, the Spanish never tried to invade any part of Asia. So I can see how one could see the west as causing a lot of strife and this was long ago. BUT the East is just as bad. The point: mankind is destructive. The west and the east is just a dividing line; sure thinking is different, philosophies are different but people are people. all seven billion people on this planet have the same basic emotions but manipulated by a religion; which in turn makes us different; some more peaceful while others are more violent.
So I don't think anyone is saying the west isn't bad, it takes two to tangle.
Mathew ∙ 16 weeks ago
G’day LA Green
Who has been blaming who for the strife in the world? Westerners of course, the easterners wouldn’t have such weapons if it wasn’t for westerners training & supplying them with such weapons & technology. I am afraid the easterners have taken on the western mode of thought & who is to blame for all this I wonder!!!!!
Please answer these questions, what’s more destructive an atom bomb or a gun or sword? Who invented the atom bomb & used it on innocent woman & children? What sort of people would device such a destructive weapon in the first place? I know it was out of necessity but to devise such a weapon in the first place is daunting to me, we are haunted to this day of a nuclear strike & of course if an eastern country uses such a weapon it’s all their fault, come on!!!
At no point did I say the west was bad, misguided yes but not bad. Yes of course as I have said here previously the east is by no means angel like but they are the ones being down trodden for over a thousand years not the west which is obviously going to cause strife & that’s all I’m saying here.
Love
Mathew
Natasha ∙ 16 weeks ago
My only point that I have been trying (and failing) to express is that no one party is to blame for the plight of the world. No one's guiltless. Everyone's hands are dirty. The Westerners stir the pot and the Easterners gladly jump in. The only thing we have in common is that we hate each other and view the other as subhuman. Because we have different religious beliefs and conflicting cultures. Why do you think we elected a president with so many ethnic roots? Unity. America is a melting pot and we need to bring everyone together and calm the tensions.
For some reason we (Americans) have forgotten the very premise of our own constitution. That all men are created EQUAL. That idea seems to only exist within the confines of our own country. For whatever reason we do not extend that belief over seas very often.
I apologize for being overly emotional earlier. My country has it's flaws, but it is still my country. I love America. I want to see it prosper and be better than what it has become. So, yes I become emotional. It's kind of like family, you know? I can say bad things about my sister, but no one else can!
Overly emotional or not - my heated rant was not incorrect. I still stand by what I have said. I think I should have stated it with a little less venom is all.
On one last note: Most of what Easterners see of Americans is the wealthy Americans. The wealthy are about 1% of us, and yes, they are assholes. Don't judge the whole society by that. Not everyone on this side supports the war. But we do support our soldiers. They are our brothers, sisters, fathers. They are all fighting for what they believe to be right, even if they are misguided by a corrupt political system that's been taken over by the corporations.
I try to see things from all sides. As a matter of fact, I have an old article that I just may post on my blog that does just that. Have a good day all and thanks for the lively debate.
Mathew ∙ 16 weeks ago
G’day Natasha
Thank you Natasha for an impartial reply, there must be a God after all……..all are at fault including me for not seeing what I can see now. You would have to admit we westerners have down trodden the east for a very long time now so of course they are going to react especially when we give them the training, weapons & technology to do so, we can only blame ourselves I’m afraid not someone else like we have been doing.
Natasha I’m a proud Australian & I also over react when my country is being wrongfully attacked so go for it girl. I’m not attacking the US but the whole mode of thought of westerners in the last thousand years which when you look deeply into it us westerners certainly haven’t helped.
I’m sorry but I do look outside the square even when it means having ago at myself & others of course, the truth is a wonderful thing to behold once obtained through all the brainwashing bullsh_t from both eastern & western sides of things.
Love
Mathew
Teddy ∙ 16 weeks ago
I would say Mathew that if you hate the western area so bad then move to the eastern area . Maybe ,, just maybe they will feel your love so much that they MIGHT let you keep your head on your shoulders. I have stated before that you should read your bible on eastern history and see if there is any differences in their time and ours. they stole land they killed whole cities they raped and lied and all that is part of human nature. You think that just because you read history that you are an expert on all subjects ? Don't flatter yourself. I don't know all the reasons that people have done the things that were done but what I do know is that IT DIDN'T START WITH US. and we don't have thousands of years doing this as you put it. I am not in total disagreement with you on subjects of mistreatment and purpose of intent from our Government, but we the people are not all the blame so calm your accusations of the westerners as a whole or get out of the country you hate so much. you might keep your head but I doubt it.
Teddy ∙ 16 weeks ago
P.S.
Here ,, check this out. I am sure it is our fault that they do this to their own
chinaview.wordpress.com/2007/03/29/list-of-china-modern-torture
I will send you some more. we don't do this to our own that I know of , but as I have said before ,,,,,human nature,,,
Teddy ∙ 16 weeks ago
Here is another one
www.vidmax.com/.../58995/Torture_Video_Smuggled_out_of_The_Middle_East
I am sure we are the cause of this as well...
Teddy ∙ 16 weeks ago
Iran Infuriated By Film Of Woman's Stoning try this one. it is on youtube.... we taught them how to do this didn't we...
For all that we are and as bad as you claim us to be. as of yet we do not stoop so low as to do this to our women.
Teddy ∙ 16 weeks ago
Just so that there is no mistake... even though I have seen all the injustices done over there I still believe that the people in general have good in them and not all are this way in the eastern areas. I have even come to know a few from over there and they are a loving people with huge giving hearts .
Mathew ∙ 16 weeks ago
G’DAY Teddy
You talk about hate a lot don’t you, psychologically think on this maybe you need help & I’m being quite serious here.
This is exactly what I mean, look at the aggressiveness here by such lovely kind westerners; I’m ashamed to be western with people like you, all I can say thank God not all westerners are like you because you give the rest of us a bad name, your actually oozing venom which is no different to what certain Christians did in the dark ages & I think that is exactly where you belong Teddy my boy in the dark ages with all that rage.
This is a very good ploy by you to attract new friends; well done indeed Teddy but a bit underhanded & sycophantic, thank God not all Americans are like you as this world would be a much bigger mess.
It looks to me you hate easterners in the way you have portrayed yourself here, very very very sad indeed, try a little acceptance for once in your life.
Not once have you proved what I have been saying is wrong Teddy my boy all you have done is slam me for my integrity which you obviously HATE. The amount of times you have said the word hate in a venomous manner tells me you need help & again I mean it as I’m not joking as I do know as I’ve worked in the welfare area twice over in my life so please get help.
I will leave you to your hate session Teddy my boy.
Love
Mathew
Mathew ∙ 16 weeks ago
G’day Fellow Bloggers
Please keep this a little civil as it’s getting a little unruly by some & please keep to the topic not Mat bashing as it shows how violent & subjective westerners can be.
The westerners have done a lot of good & they will be the first to tell you over & over again but as soon as someone mentions that they might have done wrong all hell breaks loose with some westerners oozing with venom which is exactly what I am talking about here. The ones oozing with venom are proving me quite correct in my assumptions here about aggressive westerners.
All I am after is an objective & an impartial opinion on the subject & the only ones who have done that is Natasha & Ritesh of course, I know it’s not easy to make such objective & impartial opinions but please try, it's very disheartening.
What better way is there than to admit to our western mistakes for peace in the world, if us westerners want to keep being arrogant & ignorant within our opinionated views the world will never be at peace & who’s fault would that be? The easterners again I suppose!!!
Going by what has been said here we in the west do indeed need to learn acceptance in all areas, what have we been doing all these years?????
Love
Mathew
Teddy ∙ 16 weeks ago
You should read your postings my boy, it was you who began this fight with Westerners and didn't expect a return rebuttal and maybe I am not as eloquent in my speech but I am direct and will not back down from an attacker of the Westerners and PLEASE quit trying to sound so righteous. it makes me sick reading your self righteous rhetoric.
Teddy ∙ 16 weeks ago
First off ( my boy ) you started the bashing of the Westerners and the hate you say I have is not hate but the defending of the Westerners from a hater that you have proven to be and you are not a Psychologists , Hell .... you can't even spell it. and my boy I am about twice your age. I do not hate you or anyone and anyone that knows me would tell you that. What I hate is the whining that people do like you who like to point fingers and try to sound so profound and cannot do anything to resolve it and isn't it interesting that you say not to bash Mat but you were the beginner of Western bashing. I am a Westerner and I forewarned you that we are not afraid to meet your challenge. Plus you are not even qualified to decide whether I need help and I am serious too. Not to mention that we are ashamed to have you as a Westerner and that is something we DO agree on. Hell, I'll bet you never even served our country have you. You need to grow up and quit pretending to be something you ARE NOT.
Mathew ∙ 16 weeks ago
G’day Teddy
This is exactly what I am talking about; like I said you belong in the dark ages Teddy, thanks for showing how right I am to do with westerners like yourself.
I did ask nicely not to make this any further unruly but you have shown your arrogance again Teddy & by the way this is my debate that I posted & it was supposed to show how westerners have been misguided in their dealings with the rest of the world. We so often here what good they have done but very little of what was done that wasn’t so good, it was the latter I was to focus on.
Don’t you think it would be a good healing process if we looked at ourselves objectively instead of showing all the time how arrogant we westerners are? & please get over this hate fixation & accusing others you don’t know of hate, you’re the one who keeps brining up hate all the time
In actual fact Teddy I’m not going to continue with this egotistical debate with you, you have focused your replies on me instead of the main topic obviously, no more.
Love
Mathew
Robert ∙ 16 weeks ago
Westerners have always dictated how Easterners should think, believe and speak. Neo-colonization. Basics: The official languages spoken in the East are languages that originated from the West. It is not a choice but by force.
The West indoctrinates the minds of its citizens to believe that their system is a perfect one and the only one that MUST be adopted worldwide. They maraud the East demanding enforcement of certain economic policies less they face SANCTIONS. They are in constant trouble with the Chinese e.g for its communist style of leadership. The West would hear nothing if told capitalism is wrong.
The West was faced (maybe still facing) with financial crisis as from 2006. Reason? Financial indiscipline. But they would here NONE of the advice from the East = Superiority complex. The financial crisis hit every economy in the world, of course including innocent Eastern economies (started in the West). Why? The standard currency used globally belongs to the West.
The West believe they are God-sent masters of the world (No hate please; trying to convey a message). They installed satellites in space to monitor events on earth more than for technological progress. They are now paranoid of North Korea nuclear. North Korea have openly stated it is purely for development just like the West have it. Iraq was thought by the West of having chemicals of destruction. The oil rich country was attacked, hang her president but no such chemicals found. IRONY: The path to Iraq's economic recovery is supported by the West with billions of dollars pumped into the country. ARE THE MONEY FULLY IN FORM OF GRANTS? Unfortunately, partially. The industries that would be set up would belong to Westerners. This is international POLITICAL INFLUENCE AGENDA. They will ship all profits to the West and dictate the country's political scene.
Why did the West allocate themselves VETO powers? This is a useful tool to rule the world. Any Eastern country that do not play their tune is axed. Unnecessary wars have been started by the West that were avoidable. Well, Wars in the East causes more suffering but to the West it brings prosperity. They even use wars to tame inflation in their countries and reduce unemployment.
The West set up what they call 'Development Partners' with the East. Give loans with conditions. This is a way to indirectly manage the Eastern economies. They release the funds (IMF and World Bank are in the West) with conditions of sending expats. FACTS: They loans have interest that would be repaid by innocent future generations of Easterners. A huge chunk of the loan is sadly used in paying expats sent by the West to manage the projects (part of conditions). The money would finally find its way back to the West. How will the East develop?
SADDENING: The West colonized the East. This not only mean they waged war, raped and killed, they exported the raw materials for FREE. They also enjoyed FREE and FORCED LABOR. The East participated in building Western economies. They got nothing in return but poverty.
Robert
Mathew ∙ 16 weeks ago
G’day Robert
I just wish the west would see what they have done & correct it for future peace but going by the responses I have got here that is unlikely to happen. It is funny how some people on here keep blaming their government but it’s obvious by this debate they are of the same mind as their government.
I posted this debate on other sites & got simular responses especially people from the US; I can’t see an end to the world plight unless the west comes clean & becomes accepting instead of continuing its arrogant status.
We will only have world peace on western terms by the looks of this & that is unlikely to happen as the east are actully showing a bit of back bone & muscle.
Love
Mathew
Ritesh Srivastav ∙ 16 weeks ago
Friend Mathew....I read almost every comment of this debate & personally observed some major flaws on each side....!
East & West first of all r only geographical divisions which means culturally they intersect at many points.GMT is not a cultural boundary.
Here the issues raised were arrogancy,hate,exploitation, aggressiveness,superiority complex & acceptance largely. Bro....Eastern civilization what we call in totality was not a single civilization. It consisted of the Persians,Indians,Chinese, Serbian,Japanese & many other large & small units with different cultural ideologies among themselves having some points of similarity only but the Eastern notion was common.
Same was the case with the west too.British, Italian, German, Spanish,French & American etc. was all different in ideologies with the western notion in common only.
It was the British who colonized 90 percent of the worlds nation because they were the first to think on modern scientific lines largely. The scientific & social prosperity is something we owe to them largely because they remained updated with the modern times. East was retrospective in outlook largely looking to their glorious past & heritage. Arrogance & hate r not the part of any ideology in the world.Its personal largely & is not culturally motivated. Time creates situations which moulds strategies & set standards of living & thinking.
East was spiritual somewhat but that does not mean Christ was inferior than Buddha.Both of them were everlasting symbols of love, peace & tolerance.
Both East & west coordinates each other in the present, there is no question of subordination.We r a global citizen as per modern way of thinking & will continue to assist each other beyond borders ....!
Have a good day friend .....!
Mathew ∙ 15 weeks ago
G’day Ritesh
You have made a very good formulated impartial response & yes you seem right in most of your conjectures but the British did look at easterners as being subordinate & even barbarian, that type of ideology today might have diminished but it is still there. I talk to a lot of people & some of their western responses flaw me as the old ideology are still there to a certain extent from British dominance & wouldn’t take much to infuse again in force, look at what 9/11infused !!!
How does the west look at eastern countries toady that lop off heads & hands for breaking the law but it was alright to electrocute someone in a chair or mistreat prisoners to the point of death, which one again is more barbaric than the other? Us westerners have no right to force our ideologies onto another but that is exactly what we are still doing, who has the right to do this & it’s still happening today. What about Guantanamo Bay prison.
http://www.amnesty.org.au/hrs/comments/2218/
You can’t change an ideology overnight, look at the US how it’s still moving the Indians around however they like but very little is done about it, how many western ideologist get up & protest about this kind of mistreatment. In Australia we are not so perfect ourselves but we have given the aboriginals of Australia back huge parcels of land & other various handouts.
We can & have learnt form each other & yes we are becoming more accepting but the west will only tolerate the east if it takes on western ideology & if it does it’s got to follow western made up rules concerning western ideology but when it doesn’t like with China….well what can I say!!!
Is there a dominating principle here? Of course there is because one can’t just be of their own ideology it’s got to be western to be accepted by westerners. I think you will find that the western ideological principles are still very dominant in the world if not more so than ever. The best solution would be an acceptance & the joining of all ideological principles & not to have one particular dominant ideological principle dictating & dominating the terms.
Love
Mathew
Teddy ∙ 16 weeks ago
Mat I focused my point of view exactly in the direction of the person who started all the accusations towards the Westerners and that would be you Mat. and as usual you act like a child crying because you hit and someone hit you back. YOU NEED HELP my boy,,, Your know it all arrogance shows your childlike mind and mine for letting you push my buttons. I say this,, to you and Robert. I agree that the Western People should mind their own business affairs inside of our country but imagine how it would have been for the people of those country's we hadn't stepped in. watch the videos that I posted and especially the one that you can find on the net called death by a 1000 cuts from china. If this is your type of belief that they are so much better than us then why the hell don't you do something instead of sitting in the safety of your home crying as though you really cared. all you wanted was a fight while pretending to be sophisticated and caring. You are NOT. get out and ACTUALLY do something then we will find value in your statements if any...and if you did post this on other sites and have gotten similar responses, then maybe you should take a hard look at yourself. AS for you Robert , I friended you even though you speak out against us as well which shows that I have no hate for you either. But why don't you tell us what we did that was good for these countries ... WE ARE NOT PERFECT ... BUT we seem to be the one that everyone wants to come over to. HMMMMM I watched a news report on the atrocities that were committed by the people of Africa on their own and I guarantee you that the people on the other end of the machetes, knives and guns would not have been telling us to stay away and that we are so bad. It is the people who cause the harm to their own that don't want to see us Westerners and it is because we don't agree with the atrocities that are committed.. THIS COUNTY WOULD NOT BE THE POWER THAT IT IS IF WE DID TO OUR PEOPLE WHAT OTHERS HAVE DONE TO THEIRS and we will fall as soon as we begin acting just like other countries in that respect.
Mathew ∙ 15 weeks ago
G’day Teddy
I understand your gung-ho loyalty of your country & the west as I am also loyal to my country until it does something wrong, I’m thankfully not blinded by my loyalty as wrong is wrong even if you don’t want to see it.
You have admitted attacking me not the topic of debate which I’m not interested in, you have tried to make me out to be some sort of a monster but recent replies to my new blog says something quite different as below.
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You haven’t proven me wrong or hatefully bad at all, maybe a little too direct, down to Earth & too honest for some but nothing like your trying to say I am as I might of with you, believe it or not we are quite similar in some respects.
I don’t wish to get into a childish egotistical debate with you as it usually leads nowhere, slander me as much as you like but please keep it within reason & try to keep your remarks in sync with the post. I do understand that your loyalty but I also understand it is sometimes blinding but it’s not with me & that is the biggest fundamental difference between you & me.
Love
Mathew
Robert ∙ 16 weeks ago
Teddy my friend, I neither hate you nor westerners. I did not target US as a country but the West in general. I sat and watched as Obama was being inaugurated. I did not shut my TV to avoid watching nuisance; we in Africa are proud of him (we wish Michelle will say YES to retire in Kenya) and America as a whole. I studied economics, and for the whole of my university studies, we used books written by Americans e.g Michael Todaro mostly. In short, we were learning american economic principles that made America what it is now. America has SPECIAL way of economic recovery equivalent to none in the world. There is special culture envisaged in every individual American. Hard work to improve his/her livelihood and hence a country as a whole. In late 1920's, am not sure you had been born Teddy, American industries collapsed (worse economic crisis). many were left without jobs and those who had jobs were laid off. many had to beg for food just the way the East and Africa do today. But America bounced back thanks to your president at that time and the culture of hard work in your society. That is America for you Teddy.
My brother is currently serving the American army based in Afghanistan. He is risking his whole life to defend you Teddy, ensuring that there is no repeat of 9/11 and you are enjoying good sleep. Here at home we live in fear; always freezing to death when we hear that some American soldiers were attacked. It's a crazy feeling but we live with it.
America has done many good things to the world but the West in general, I think they are not doing good enough. In fact derailing economic development in the East for this matter. They demand enforcement of millennium development goals (developing countries flaws) while on the other hand are reluctant to curb environmental pollution. The other points I stated above.
Teddy ∙ 16 weeks ago
Thank you Robert.... I am just a little apprehensive when I hear some things. Thank you for your particpation and explanation ,, also please tell your brother he has my grattitude . Your friend Ted
Mathew ∙ 15 weeks ago
G'day Robert
It is fine to say the US has a SPECIAL ways of economic recovery but it’s usually through war. The economy & the people under that economy might suffer but the big boys don’t, they profit big time in war & that is a fact. They didn’t just profit during the war but after the Second World War the US gave loans to various European countries which the big boys of the US profited greatly by.
However with the big boys profiting so well from such ventures post war booms are always expected so in the end the economy & the people of that economy boom as well to some degree but it still needs war to produce such a boom in the first place. What lead the world out of the great depression? It was war profiteering. Who has sold numerous weapons, technology & expertise to the east ever since? Profiteering westerners.
The US might fork out trillions to the world but it makes sure it gets that many times back; I would have to admit that is good economics but it needs the rest of the world to prop it up.
Just take a look how the French, Russians & yes the Chinese have profiteered from war, war is big business & the east isn’t missing out on their share either. Teaching the easterners to profit from war as well isn’t a good thing & will probably continue our plight in the world for years to come that of course is if we make it as war profiteering does need a lot of energy to sustain it which of course means polluting the atmosphere & the very ground we walk on. We are now polluting the subterranean on mass now through hydraulic fracturing, but another western invention that will help with our demise.
I care so I speak out instead of sitting on my hands doing nothing, I can’t see anything wrong with that!!
Love
Mathew
Mathew ∙ 15 weeks ago
G’day Fellow Bloggers
I’m a westerner having ago at my own western ideology & that is my right , if a westerner can’t have a shot at their own ideology no one can because if an easterner did the same all hell would break loose.
All I am doing is pointing out our own faults which are many, this debate wasn’t to point out eastern faults but western & if some westerners don’t like looking at their own mess turn away & bury your heads in the sand but don’t ridicule me for being honest & straight forward please. Would I have a right to point out all the faults of easterners? No of course not but many westerners do like with 9/11 for starters or what others are doing in this debate. Again this debate wasn’t about eastern faults but some people just can’t help themselves in ridiculing other ideologies but rarely reticule their own.
No one person is at fault in the world as it is the way it is for whatever reason but at least we should be aware of what’s really going on instead of what we are being brainwashed to believe. My blogs on acceptance & we all need to learn that in the world to accept not just the rights we have done but the wrongs as well.
Again if I can’t have ago at my own western ideological taught modes of thought who can?
Love
Mathew
Teddy ∙ 15 weeks ago
It's all about beliefs Natasha and though we differ in them , as he said he has the right to question and protest wrong doings . on that I can agree. I say don't bite the hand that feeds you so to speak and though we don't agree, we are blogger family and he is NOT my enemy. though it may seem so to some. we are both head strong and opinionated. You know,,, two rams butting heads but we won't kill each other over it. that's all
Natasha ∙ 15 weeks ago
Wow. This discussion as turned into a testosterone fueled pissing match. You guys figured out who's twig -n- berries are biggest yet? I think I am checking out of this one.
Mathew ∙ 15 weeks ago
G’day Teddy
Well Teddy I agree in full, we make an awful sound when we butt heads but it’s not as bad as it sounds.
When I referred to as Teddy my boy it wasn’t meant to sound derogative, I was actually being respectful of you being so loyal but in rereading it you could quite easily have taken it the wrong way & I’m sorry for that. I actually call older women girls at times depending in how friendly I am like “g’day girl hows ya going” or with holder blokes “g’day Michael my boy”, it’s just the way I am.
Sorry again for any inflammatory remarks I made against your persona Teddy but it will probably happen again!!
Love
Mathew
Teddy ∙ 15 weeks ago
we may disagree Mat and but heads on things but I know that if we ever met we would be friends regardless ... we are ok... we are friends still the same and your views are just as valid as mine but once the fire is gone , friendship remains. I do understand your worries but I fear we have much bigger problems on the horizon within this country and remember the saying divide and conquer ? That is what I am fighting I. the division within. we are cool Mat. No worries.......Ted
Teddy ∙ 15 weeks ago
P.S. as for you words here saying ( Sorry again for any inflammatory remarks I made against your persona Teddy but it will probably happen again!! )
No worries because as I have said before to, I will meet your challenge anytime . that's what makes things real interesting and fun. see you on the next round if need be.
Mathew ∙ 15 weeks ago
We have a saying in this country " your bloods worth bottling"....av a good one Teddy
Jimmykopelia ∙ 15 weeks ago
We can play the Blame game and name the good and bad of every civilization of our history. What is the purpose? So we can our personal ego enhanced. Please, life is not a competition and Humans would be become greater if we learn to tolerate each person view of life.
Mathew ∙ 15 weeks ago
G’day Jimmy
The purpose is making ourselves truthfully aware of the bad our kind have done onto the world so that we can heal towards a more peaceful existence because what’s not dealt with we take with us which is usually something which is festering. If you take the holocaust for instance, if we all buried our heads in the sand like so many tried to do all the perpetrators would have got off free plus Germany wouldn’t have healed. It was the German people who had much more healing to do than the victims.
Blame no as I’m not looking at blame even if it looks that way, self-acceptance of what wrong we have done yes by all means because one can’t heal until the saw is tended too. Look at the Israeli’s & the Arabs, a lot of the Arabs obviously don’t want to heal the festering saw so they won’t accept the wrong they have done to a number of different nations but of course they too have been persecuted.
I’m accepting that my kind has done wrong & it feels a lot better to me because if we can’t accept each other for who they are & the wrong we have done peace will always stay a dream. Ignorance is blinding so stop being blinded by it as it really doesn’t hurt that much to own up to our own short falls.A little humbleness will go a long way towards peace on Earth or am I fooling myself, anyway it's still a nice dream.
Love
Mathew
Jimmykopelia ∙ 12 weeks ago
It is very wise to learn from our history and trying not to make same mistakes. What we need to learn that every civilization, every nation, and group ethnic has their own culture with own uniqueness . By accepting , I must learn to accept , assimilate , and tolerate them. as a example, that we do not learn from our mistakes. The world war ii was fought because one country, Germany, wanted to conquer the world. They though they were superior race and they had the right to dominate the world. The Holocaust was their solution to ethnic cleansing. Is this has happened again? yes.. see The Serb against Muslim, In Rwanda too. Now, another question was the definition of westerners and easterners? I'm was born in Lima, Peru.. Do you think all Peruvians are westerner? What I do no like and really hate is when people put name tags on people. In the case of majority of Peruvians, they had their own civilization with own unique culture with some Christian influence
Mathew ∙ 11 weeks 6 days ago
G'day Jimmy
Tagging people for being this that or the other isn't quite correct like with the Germans during WWll they weren’t all Nazi’s & all Muslims aren’t religious fundamentalist fanatics either , I suppose ideology defines what’s what no matter where you live in the world.
Love
Mathew
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